WTF?

[pecunium]

Recently, at work, something odd happened.

Guy came in, and started to ask me questions about knives. So far all is normal. Selling knives is a lot of what I do. We talk about this and that, and he starts being discoursive. He then asks me one of those questions I've had, now and again, though not here; at SLT.

"What do you think of women using knives?"


"I don't have any problem with it."

He went on, saying from things he'd seen them doing in the kitchen it gave him the willies. I said he ought to see the things I see men doing with knives. Then I tried to point out that it was more a matter of preconceptions than anything else. I told him I'd been in the army for 167 years, and I taught firearms handling, as well as knife skills. This was to lead into telling him that I far prefer to have female students (in firearms) than I do male ones (in knives it doesn't have the same gender skew, though there are traits I think I see more in women than in men. There are other traits I think I see in men more. some good, some bad, in both sexes).

That did, so I thoght, derail the conversation, but it was being a bit strange, and I wanted to done with it. He started asking me questions about guns, and I started actually moving him out of the store. On the way he started asking me about my thoughts on "open carry". My thoughts on the carryng of firearms are pretty simple. Most people shouldn't do it because they don't think it through carefully enough (for more detailed ideas of my thinking you can read the post/comments in places like Making Light (where the subject has come up, more than once).

I tried to say this, gently, but I was starting to get an odd vibe. I actually started pushing him out of the store (my boss actually noticed this). At the door he kept going, and then it happened, he explained why he was looking into things like "open carry" (which right he didn't know we had in Calif. never mind that as configured it's a mess... asking for trouble and conferring no real benefit to anyone who isn't willing to spend lots of time getting a number of drills down to pure muscle memory. Even if that's done the requirements still make you much more target than anything else... all of which I mentioned to him).

It's because of the political situation now, and the "trouble we have coming with the blacks and the browns".

I was croggled. He'd just given me what can only be described as the tea-bagger's secret handshake. I wasn't certain until he added, "You know I used to be a liberal."

The next say, he was back. Asked if I had a card, and then (when I said I didn't really. Which was true, in context. I don't have a card for my work, and I had no intent of sharing my personal one with him). That, it seemed was ok. He had one to give me, with a slightly conspiratorial leaning in as he said, "I might have some work for you."

Comments

[inflectionpoint.livejournal.com]

I know someone who carries. But he lives out on a ranch an hour up a mine road in Livermore and he works alone most of his days outdoors. The chances of a rabid dog or other Critter are worth it.

Of course the other problem with living and working that Far Out is that you might be the lucky person to discover someone's clandestine meth lab on your property. Not good.

[cpolk.livejournal.com]

HOLY CRAPDOODLES

you won the whacko lottery!

I'm hoping this post will not serendipitously become HANDY EVIDENCE. wow.

[inflectionpoint.livejournal.com]

breaks my brain tho -

if you know I'm carrying, and you're a problem person, the fact that you know I'm carrying puts me at a... not advantage. I may not get those frew seconds, and that can be bad.

If you don't know, and if I'm ready, that's different.

I can't -imagine- wanting to carry unloaded and for all to see. What on earth is the point?

[bedii.livejournal.com]

Hmmm... "Strangers on a Train" comes to mind. Although I'd hate to pick a director if there's a movie version: DePalma seems to have gone through his Hitchcock phase and I'd hate for him to visit there again.

[charisstoma.livejournal.com]

Yes, I like your response too if this person came back to do follow up. I'd be afraid that he might think that here was a loose end that needed to be cleaned up before the militia was reported to the police state. But then I might being paranoid.

[charisstoma.livejournal.com]

That occurred to me too. Both are possible but the whole thing is creepy.

Re: Creepy creepy creepy

[bedii.livejournal.com]

And who plans to help it along if possible.

[bedii.livejournal.com]

The only suggestion I can give is that if he comes back, be very, very boring. I've done that a time or two with the creepily obsessed with some success, mainly because I was in situations where I couldn't play the "I'm much crazier than you are" card.

[pecunium.livejournal.com]

It wasn't safe to let him steer the boat... no wait, that was Hank.

[pecunium.livejournal.com]

Because in Calif., unless it's a felon; there is no legal requirement to have a permit to carry; so long as it isn't loaded. I admit, for a revolver that might require a small amount of specialised knowledge, but an unloaded automatic is pretty easy to spot, even for those who don't shoot.

Now that I've chimed in, thanks to the both of you for not letting things get out of hand.

[pecunium.livejournal.com]

I understand his attitude. I often feel a trifle naked, for lack of a firearm.

Some of that is PTSDish, and part of it is massive habit. I've spent a lot of time where the furthest a firearm was from my person was a bit more than arm's reach. There is a whole set of internal math that leads to.

I don't feel scared for lack of a firearm; when this happens, any more than I feel scared when I don't have cutlery on my hip. It's just that I feel a bit undressed.

[pecunium.livejournal.com]

And my thinking is... that's worse than no gun at all. It's in the open. Getting it out draws attention. The person who was the cause of your desire to shoot (why else draw), is really likely to 1: see you, and 2: have a firearm out.

At which point the odds of you being shot go from random, to almost certain.

The other thing (and where I understand, but for different reasons, disagree with jaylake), is that the people doing this are doing it for political statement. I'd really like the populace to make that sort of carry less pleasant (mosty by denying them service in establishments).

Calling the cops on them just confirms, to them, the need to carry. That will, of course, be used to recruit/propagandise.

What I might like to see, if they are not being dissuaded by merchants, I'd like to see a lot of persons of color carrying in the areas they tend to travel.

[dichroic.livejournal.com]

That makes sense (after all, William Penn made much the same complain to George Fox, IIRC). I apologize if I was too general. I've met a number of people who carry a knife in a scabbard and use it every day; I suspect they'd feel the same way.

I have a grandfather-in-law who's a master gunsmith; especially now that his wife is gone, there are rifles *everywhere* in his house. I think he'd probably agree with you about feeling naked without one to hand ... but I don't feel the least bit unsafe around him, no matter what armaments are there.

But in the specific case I'm thinking of, I really think it was fear rather than habit; he used words like "I feel unsafe" rather than "I feel underdressed". To my knowledge, he'd never been in the military or been a subsistence hunter (though I guess in the latter case you'd carry a rifle rather than a handgun anyway).

[pecunium.livejournal.com]

I don't understand just what it was he was trying to do with that. People often say things like "x" does "y" stupid things. The "x" often being female.

What I don't get is why he thought (from nothing but notes about how to properly use knives) he chose to sound me out on the subject.

I am then not sure why he assumed that I (who think women with knives is fine, and that they are better students for firearms training) would agree with him on the "trouble" with "blacks and browns", and the (stereotypical) throwaway of his having been a liberal in the past.

Do I look like some sort of reactionary racist?

[pecunium.livejournal.com]

Occam says not so likely.

1: I didn't make any of the right responses to assume I was all that interested (if one were looking to find the susceptible).

2: I didn't get that vibe, and I am pretty good at sussing out people having hidden motives.

[pecunium.livejournal.com]

If he said unsafe... yeah minor alarm bells.

[pecunium.livejournal.com]

Salt.

[don-fitch.livejournal.com]

Well... you look as though you _could_ be, and people like the guy you describe often seem to have the delusion that most other people share their weird & paranoid attitudes. But then, come to think on't, I usually feel that most other people share my (perfectly sane and sensible, of course) attitudes.

[pecunium.livejournal.com]

These days I look sort of like a hippie.

[eyelessgame.livejournal.com]

with a slightly conspiratorial leaning in as he said, "I might have some work for you."

You do have to recognize the possibility that what he wants you to do is help him move out of his parents' basement -- you being the fortieth person he's asked, and someday he might actually go ahead and do it.

Granted that's not a whole lot less creepy than the other possibilities, but the ratio of wannabes (*) to actual creeps is ... not low. Talk is cheap.

(*) depending on one's POV, "wannabes" could also refer to "potential creeps".

[starcat-jewel.livejournal.com]

So far I wouldn't say he's done anything legally actionable. But if he comes back to you with something dubious... well, if it's just dubious, get a lawyer's opinion. If it's more than that, then yeah, report him and take whatever legal means you must to get him picked up and charged.

[starcat-jewel.livejournal.com]

Not to me. Moneyed Persons are among the worst. They're just not usually quite so open about it where they think People Who Matter might hear them. As a fat middle-aged woman, I don't count as a Person Who Matters.

Re: Creepy creepy creepy

[ginmar.livejournal.com]

Yeah. Exactly. And now I'm wondering....if they're that vile beforehealth care, now what?

[hal-obrien.livejournal.com]

"They'll be pretty goddam surprised when they get here."

Which only reminds of an extended vignette, starting with a real event:

Every time the guy saw Evelyn's dog, he thought it the height of humor to abuse her tail-wagging eagerness to please. "Fawn! Fawn! Teleport!" he would say, in that voice of command, like "Fetch!"

Then one day, Fawn did. Teleport, that is. On command.

Boy, was he surprised.

[fledgist.livejournal.com]

*snort*

I was going to ask about Winfield Scott.