I was wrong

It seems the early returns I saw were on a different bit of the fight over this.

The real numbers are worse.

65-34.

Only one republican voted against it (Chafee) and 12 dems voted for it.

Word on the street is that people are afraid that filibustering it will hurt them, given what happened last time around (with "principle votes" wherein the elected official votes the way he thinks will make him look good, because the margin is so lop-sided [like say an bill to make teaching physics to anyone who wasn't 18] that voting against the way the bill comes out is just a parlor trick, a bit of theater to make it look as if one has priciples) there doesn't seem to be any reason to not filibuster. To not actually show some principles.

So, the offending Democrats are :Carper (Del.), Johnson (S.D.), Landrieu (La.), Lautenberg (N.J.), Lieberman (Conn.), Menendez (N.J), Nelson (Fla.), Nelson (Neb.), Pryor (Ark.), Rockefeller (W. Va.), Salazar (Co.), Stabenow (Mich.).

Jeffords voted against it.

This is going to be a nasty can of worms to try and fix.

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Huh. That's a surprise. I know somebody who knows Salazar (you do, too). Wonder what they think?

I'm staggered (and pleased) that Bartlett and Wynn - neither of them prizes - had the cojones to vote against.

Thank all $DEITIES that Feinstein didn't wuss out. I figured Boxer was a safe no, but Dianne scares me at times.

I lost most of my respect for Feinstein when I found out she had a concealed carry permit. It's not that I'm against them, but she is.

TK

Rubber stamping Ashcroft did it for me, but I see your point about the permit. Still have that memory of Moscone and Milk dead in SF City Hall ingrained in my mind, but that doesn't excuse DF's ok for her but not for others attitude.

Hey, Lieberman voted for it, what a shock. :-b

Screw it. Fillibuster. When the Dem's retake the Senate, any anti-fillibuster measure the Republicans put into place can come back and bite them in the ass.

And I don't know what to do. I have a feeling that the next elections are going to be rigged anyway, and any amount of lobbying by the people is going to matter absolutely nothing. We got a party in power that doesn't give a shit about anyone who isn't a millionaire, and doesn't care about cheating either. Those people I loathed in college are in power and it's about as depressing as it can get for me. And the "opposition" party is being called disloyal if they are too vocal about their opposition and are caving to it, becoming weak-willed shit bags.

The other alternative to rigged elections is that in 2008 we are going to be put on permanant emergency and the repugs will announce Bush our Dear Ruler.

Doesn't make much difference.

I vote every chance I get but it ain't making any change. The folks I vote for lose except the local folk.

I don't know if the military can make an answer, I expect that the rank and file are to obedient to say, "Wait, I swore to uphold the constitution. WTF?" (I'm not positive about what involves being sworn in as an officer and I don't think enlisted have to swear an oath, I am probably wrong, it's been too long.)'

I don't know if we the people can make an answer, too many want security and they don't realize that it's eventually going to cost freedoms that involve them at the most personal level (like freedom to travel from state to state).

I don't want to emigrate, I'm too much in debt plus I love my city and house. It may get to a point where I want to go to Auz or Canada, but not just yet. But I wonder when it will.

I despair.

We swear an oath, it's not much different from the officers.

On my bad days, I see civil war.

On my not so bad days I see dark times ahead, and a return to sanity (which requires turning the bums out. After that I don't know what it needs to prevent their return, but that has to happen too).

On my really bad days I see neither of those.

TK

On my somewhat bad days I see war, and not a civil one.

This entire thing just chills me.

I suspect a good many Congresspeople are getting ready to use the "I expect(ed) the Supreme Court to find it unconstitutional, so it doesn't matter that I didn't oppose it" dodge. I also suspect there's a strong chance this won't work. And I can only hope (vs. "expect") that by the time it comes before them, if it ever does, the Supreme Court will decide that way.

That will say whatever they want the people want them to say... people that matter like Bush, and Rove, and etc. If they're caught with their hand in the trap, they'll go, "this is not a violation, I didnt' intend to do it, I was entrapped." They don't care, they don't consider that their stupidity costs lives Americans hold dear because they so don't care.

and I imagine a time soon when anyone posting this kind of dissidence online will be getting a federal visitor. And once we're arrested, we can be tortured until we tell them what they want to hear. I despair.

Justice and the rule of law has just gone higglety pigglety.

I was voting for Lamont anyway, but this is just one more reason to be angry at Lieberman. (I really wish he weren't up a steady 10 points in the polls - maybe being lost at the bottom of the ballot will help. Sigh.)

Simmons lost my vote, too, with this crap. I wasn't thrilled with Courtney, and I *wanted* to vote for him, but - no.

I was wrong

Salazar

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I am now officially ashamed of being an American

Re: I am now officially ashamed of being an American

Re: I am now officially ashamed of being an American

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Don, they're a huge pile of weasels

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